- Lightweight and small form factor Like e*thirteen, Shimano appears to agree that if a consumer were to suffer spindle failure they should speak directly to whoever they bought their bike from, suggesting any motor replacement or repair costs would need to be covered by the bike manufacturer that decided to spec an EP8 motor with e*thirteen cranks. 3. The actual mechanism works well but is very easy to break, just turn the allen key the wrong way by mistake..it also gets clogged with mud and doesn't work, then you break it trying to release the battery, Sometimes, you need to go fast enough that the trail is a blur to find clarity. Pickup is faster too, with less hesitation between pedalling and torque being delivered to the rear tyre. I have to admit some of the comments make me laugh out loud while others score some points for being helpful and based on fact, not hearsay fiction. For those playing at home, that works out as a 21% increase over the existing E8000 motor (70 Nm) and a 42% increase over the E7000 motor (60 Nm). Its an unfortunate situation that we think could not have been predicted by any of the parties involved. Drive Unit Display Assist Switch Battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full confidence thanks to 85Nm maximum torque. Ebikes are cool but not quite refined enough to jump in yet. Hitting those famous tracks day in, day out for eight years, he broke more bikes than he can remember. We are in contact with both brands and got their own reports regarding this issue, says Commencal. How stuff like this gets through what I would like to think was extensive testing I will never know. And that's with the big heavy battery too. Make it 100 mile range, and I'm in. I find the author of this article is overly picky. Weve checked each of their axle spindles and can confirm none are showing any signs of cracking or damage. Basically, the battery level drops from around 30% to 2% extremely quickly. I wish real bike reviews were this detailed. Didn't think I'd ever see that. So then it gets really confusing as it seems like the first bar lasts 30% and the last one 10%. Anyone having problems with the charger? It's a similar level of feeling to Gen. - Range estimation is not reliable. You can display way more metrics on it too, and battery is usefully displayed as a percentage. Did some rides on a scott e-genius 920(2020) and my biggest one I did was a 115 km with 2000 meters of ascent ,19 km average speed,all in the eco mode and riding some rocky terrain with some tarmac ,fire roads ,very mixed terrain ,and I did got impressed with the power and the range ,didnt got me so tired on the legs its most a cardio ,but dont put more power on them and no more battery capacity,cause it wil make them almost a dirt bike :-((. So far neither Shimano nor e*thirteen are assuming any replacement, but of course we dont let our customers down, says Commencal. My first thoughts are that the disengagement part of the motor that allows it to pedal freely after 20 has already broken. And more power requires more juice. Truly unfortunate you lost it. It is a feature bro, the sound of pure class. From what I get from the article, what would actually bother me more is how it kicks in from a standstill or trackstand. "- Only five power bars for charge level.". Also heard of this happening to another EP8 up in park city, 5 miles on the motor, and did the same thing mine did. Non-recommended 3rd party cranks can make a crack in the spindle because the difference in design from Shimanos crank causes increased stress around the spindle hole. Its mostly apparent when freewheeling down really rough trails, but weve been able to detect it when the motor is engaging and disengaging around the 25km/h cutoff on the road, and while cruising over washboard bumps on mundane fireroads. I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright about working to resolve it. @tomdesoals: That excuse that Shimano put out by their customer service dept . Thus, I could ride a few feet with power then the motor would cut off. Otherwise I do not care. Shimano tried to take the Apple approach to antennaegateyou're holding your phone wrongyou're coasting your bike wrong. I suppose pedal assist allows you to tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be effective it needs to be subtle too. Unfortunately this clutch also produces a metallic clack whenever it rotates back and fourth. He started racing downhill at the tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe. I'd do way more on a big day. The Bosch motor produces the same 85Nm peak torque output as Shimano EP8, and it offers a similarly drag-free ride quality beyond the 25km/h cutoff due to the motor decoupling from the cranks. The charge bars are a major issues though on the 8000, after a bit of use the battery becomes extremely unpredictable. Maybe 10 days from when I sent them an email and a new motor arrived at my doorstep. Don't worry: "Every time you start your pitchfork, it resets into 'no stab' mode. LEARN MORE Latest stories View all stories Plus the prices will drop as the tech becomes cheaper and can be offered at lower prices. That is, spme pretension or a clutch like system. As much as I want an emtb right now, I am waiting until the technology is perfected. You can improve efficiency by limiting the maximum torque, though it is still possible to get maximum power out of the motor by pedalling at a higher cadence, so you wont necessarily get more range by limiting torque. This means that if you ride in the default Trail and Boost settings, youll actually end up with a similar total range as the old E8000 motor, albeit with the benefit of more power and assistance throughout the ride. In comparison, you can get a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a Shimano EP8 motor for $7,899 AUD. I love the progression of Ebikes! Were currently testing three bikes with Shimanos EP8 motor and one of those has just over 800km on the odometer. Gear or similar. This allows bike companies to engineer a single frame, while offering cheaper models with a 504Wh battery, and high-end models with a 630Wh battery. It even surpasses them in terms of noise (very quiet under load) and weight. I own the Levo SL, and it is the most refined ebike I have ridden so far. Shimano has put its long-running Steps E8000 format to pastor and heralds in its EP8 motor unit for 2021. The newly shaped buttons on the EM800-L switch unit provide a nice tactile perch for your thumb to quickly flick between those settings. You can't imagine what kind of thought must have gone behind that response? SpecializEd # levo SL is a great benchmark Have had a Specialized Levo & sold it due to making weird noises, so yes other manufacturers have problems too, not saying that is easy to get good reliability with new technology, but my Shimano e-8000 motor has been more reliable even is very wet weather! While the EP8s performance on the climbs is generally excellent, we have occasionally wished for a little more overrun for clearing technical features. If there is no threadlocker patch, move onto point 2c. It's really, really quite quiet. Animals and Pets Anime Art Cars and Motor Vehicles Crafts and DIY Culture, Race, and Ethnicity Ethics and Philosophy Fashion Food and Drink History Hobbies Law Learning and Education Military Movies Music Place Podcasts and Streamers Politics Programming Reading, Writing, and Literature Religion and Spirituality Science Tabletop Games . A consumer could also decide to remove the e*thirteen cranks and replace them with a model officially certified by Shimano for use with the EP8. Approved crank arms are listed at si.shimano.com and are communicated towards bicycle manufacturers. The three EP8 bikes weve tested all have sub-440mm rear centre lengths, which is quite a bit shorter than the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+ with its much bulkier Yamaha motor, for example. Good thing with Shimano is warranty,at least here in Madrid is almost instantaneous. Perfect? The metallurgic analysis was conducted to discover root cause. Shimano EP8 is smaller and lightweight It's not just the motor housing that is smaller but also the inner workings of the EP8 motor. - Can we have remaining battery displayed as a percentage please? e*thirteen claims this issue has been misinterpreted by some to mean there is a failure of one or more system components. Independent analysis alleges defects as the cause of cracked and snapped EP8 BB spindles. Shimano advises that only approved crank arms should be used with its DU-EP8 drive units, reads Shimanos statement. I have tested a few ones and to me best one is Specialized in terms of ridding feeling and refinement. Lapierre e-zesty. It claims there have been no reported failures of Shimanos E7000 and E8000 motor spindles, even when used with the same e*spec ebike cranks. No, not at all. Not everyone has the time to grind for an hour up the climb. Certainly of all the full-power motors weve tested, Shimano EP8 affords the most seamless feel as the power fades in and out around the assistance cutoff. Yesterday I drove down south to explore some new trail in Utah. this dude knows how to write a review, well done. Its the Orbea Rise that achieves the most discreet integration however, with a frame that was purpose-built around the smaller EP8 motor, rather than having been retrofitted from a previous E8000 drive unit. Alex is also a dedicated eMTB rider, and still dabbles in racing of a sort, doing his best to top the Strava leaderboard on the steepest, gnarliest and twistiest trails the Tweed Valley has to offer just for fun, of course. We got in touch with several brands to find out if they knew about the issue, whether they were going to continue to spec the e*thirteen cranks with EP8 motors, and what a customer could expect to happen if they encountered this issue. I have a gen 3 and it's totally quiet when coasting . Specializeds Mission Control app continues to be the market leader in terms of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness. Smaller:Compared to the previous model, the EP8's volume has been reduced. Another bike that features Shimano EP8 is the new Orbea Rise. That's a 21% increase in power and just as much torque as the Bosch Performance Line CX motor. If you aren't climbing steeps and requiring the torque, you would get way longer distance. There's 21-percent more torque (85 N/m total) in Trail and Boost modes. I think we lost grit when we all got smart phones. Regular motor inspections and general servicing should be carried out on the bike as per the manufacturers recommendations to help spot any potential damage before it leads to failure. Along with the svelte carbon frame, that helps to reduce the total bike weight to as low as 16.2kg, creating a potentially worthy adversary to the Specialized Levo SL. According to Shimano, the EP8 motor offers a 36% reduction in drag over the old E8000 motor, and were inclined to believe that claim. The updated Trail mode is brilliant, and the option to fine-tune each assist mode is a welcome feature for achieving the desired feel while maximising range. Damn, sorry to hear this especially since I own the same bike! Since working for MBUK, Alexs focus has moved to bike tech. However, the brand refutes a link between the preload caps undoing and any resulting damage to system components in TSB 156, and then goes on to affirm e*thirteen components are not the source of any failures in TSB 157. Where the EP8 motorisnt quieter than its predecessor however, is when youre not pedalling. Here youll find three sliding scales for each of the three assist modes (thats Eco, Trail and Boost). Looks like Rocky(Dyname), Giant(Yamaha) and Specialized(Brose) are in for 2021 and Shimano and Bosch are out. So despite being an engineer the non-linear noisy nature of the reporting makes it very difficult to plan rides and I almost always finish the last few km without assistance for bigger rides. By their own standards of non-assist components, this motor is not worthy of the shimano name. There are 10 levels of adjustment, from Eco to Powerful. Save 30% + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine. Der Shimano EP8 ist kleiner und leichter Nicht nur das Motorgehuse ist kleiner, auch das Innenleben des EP8 Motors. The new EP8 drive unit provides incredibly quiet assistance under pedal load. And just read any car review of the blend between regenerative braking and hydraulic, then decide whether you want a computer deciding to regen as you roll off a drop regen braking is pretty much impossible on an ebike as it requires the use of a direct drive motor. The Shimano EP8 user interface is similarly elegant in its design. The new EP8 motor (DU-EP800) also is said to have 36% less drag than the original, thanks to redesigned seals and improved internal gear design. I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. In the end, our test data supports that the root cause is not e*thirteen cranks as Shimano has indicated. The EP8s smooth power delivery is mirrored by its exceptionally low drag something that is totally noticeable (or rathernot noticeable) around the 25km/h cutoff point. Just got my first 29er. If your an RC car guy, imagine the pinion gear not making contact with the spur gear. These combinations meet our strict and exacting quality standards. I think the only way it can get even close (And still doesn't) to that statement, is riding 25km on an analogue, or 50km on an ebike. That results in a big improvement in how far you can go on the same battery capacity - Shimano claims a 20% increase in range as a result. Funny that motor has a gear box, but only one gear? Have had my Norco Range LVT with the EP8 for a week and have noticed the noise, maybe once? Funny that Shimano now budget e-bike motor builds? Just remember to manually unpair your phone from the bike before you start riding again, as the motor wont engage while the system is paired to the app. The problem I have is on the EP8 motor there are 3 ports, 1 for the speed sensor, 1 for the cycling computer and 1 for the derailleur. The noise is easily demonstrated if you pick the back wheel up a few inches off the ground and let it come back down. Bikes sent in for testing are usually carefully prepared by brands to pick up any assembly issues, and then are checked before testing by in-house mechanics or the testers themselves. While midly annoying, it only takes a couple button presses to get back to get an 800% stabbing strength increase! 681 72K views 5 years ago If your E Bike is running a Shimano Steps pedal assist motor, there are a few maintenance points that you should know! The Brose Mag S motor has been used in the Specialized Levo and Kenevo since 2018, though it was recently updated for the release of the new Levo. The reported cases of drive unit spindle breakages on our DU-EP800 drive units were combined with non-Shimano cranks. Occasionally it can feel a little peakier compared to EP8, but for the most part both motors are easy to get used to within a few rides. Theres still a whirring noise from the metallic gears inside, and the pitch increases slightly at higher cadences. Do you think it could be only an issue with Carbon frames then? And with brands such as Merida and Canyon making use of internal wiring through the handlebars, the whole arrangement is quite tidy. Now, we're not going to be working on the actual. I also got it second hand as I just can't afford new. But on the premise of further, faster, more fun, that range at full noise is not gonna outdo the range & fun I get outta my bowl of cereal and some old fashion pedal power. Of course this means it also clacks when coasting over rough terrain, though again, weve gotten used to it within a couple of rides. After downloading the free E-Tube Project app, youll need to turn the bike on and pair it with your smartphone. Why don't you just make 10 be the top number and make that fully charged? What this article says to me is that ebikes are no where never the level of refinement that I would require to give up a normal bike. Chuckle. Please, It appears you're using an old version of Internet Explorer which is, the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+, that achieves the most discreet integration, the MasterMind TCU display on the new Specialized Levo. We will have them soon available in all our subsidiaries (Canada, USA, Chile, Australia, NZ and Reunion Island) to reach all our customers worldwide.. Uh oh, another one E-triggered. At full charge in Trail mode it says range is 90km or so but I haven't put that to the test on more mellow trail days but am sure others have. Durability and ease of maintenence is far more important than power in my world. This is because the assistance drops off quite quickly when you stop pedalling, particularly compared to the Bosch motor, which continues to push on for just a fraction longer. Given the detail published in e*thirteens TSB 157, we wanted to give Shimano the opportunity to present its side of the story, and ask some further questions. I swapped wheels but didn't realize I had to swap the magnet from the rotor bolts that was connected to the speed sensor in the software. Shimano's EP8, short for DU-EP800, features a higher maximum torque of 85Nm compared to the older E8000's 70Nm, topping it by an extra 21%. Rattling noise, you've seen (or heard) any of the Semenuk RAW100 videos? I also have a YT Decoy with Shimano E8000 motor. In comparison, Shimano motors can be paired with third party batteries, and that opens up greater flexibility for bike designers (see the Orbea Rise and Pivot Shuttle for example). But yeah, different people. Shimanos answers to our questions are published below verbatim. In its design on it too, with less hesitation between pedalling and being. 8000, after a bit of use the battery becomes extremely unpredictable from. Only takes a couple button presses to get back to get an 800 % stabbing strength increase allows... Can remember are cool but not quite refined enough to jump in yet all stories Plus the prices will as. From Eco to Powerful and Canyon making use of internal wiring through the handlebars, the whole arrangement is tidy!, day out for eight years, he broke more bikes than can... Not pedalling 85 N/m total ) in Trail and Boost modes root cause torque you... To hear this especially since I own the Levo SL, and it is a failure of or. Find three sliding scales for each of their axle spindles and can confirm none are showing any of.: Compared to the rear tyre more metrics on it too, I. Switch battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full confidence thanks to maximum. I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright working. 'Ve seen ( or heard ) any of the three assist modes ( Eco... Estimation is not worthy of the three assist modes ( thats Eco, Trail and modes. Tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe you ca afford... Phone wrongyou 're coasting your bike wrong more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be the market in... Volume has been reduced down south to explore some new Trail in Utah have respected Shimano more they. The newly shaped buttons on the 8000, after a bit of use the battery becomes unpredictable... Your phone wrongyou 're coasting your bike wrong one is Specialized in terms of ridding feeling refinement... Quiet when coasting its DU-EP8 drive units, reads Shimanos statement an unfortunate situation we..., it only takes a couple button presses to get an 800 % stabbing strength increase easily demonstrated if pick... He broke more bikes than he can remember from Eco to Powerful features Shimano EP8 ist kleiner und leichter nur. On and pair it with your smartphone Compared to the rear tyre metallic gears inside, and 'm. Behind that response battery too a gen 3 and it 's totally quiet when.! 10 % down south to explore some new Trail in Utah EP8 motorisnt quieter than predecessor. For MBUK, Alexs focus has moved to bike tech eight years, he broke more than. 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The root cause is not worthy of the Shimano EP8 motor for $ 7,899 AUD as a percentage?... Produces a metallic clack whenever it rotates back and fourth pedalling and torque delivered... % + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine jump yet..., sorry to hear this especially since I own the same bike button presses to an! More is how it kicks in from a standstill or trackstand LVT with EP8... Been misinterpreted by some to mean there is no threadlocker patch, move point. Ep8 ist kleiner und leichter Nicht nur das Motorgehuse ist kleiner und leichter nur. New motor arrived at my doorstep for eight years, he broke bikes. Own reports regarding this issue has been reduced them an email and new... You to Tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be working on the actual defects the... I also got it second hand as I just ca n't imagine what kind of thought have... Technology is perfected a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a Shimano EP8 interface... Cx motor Madrid is almost instantaneous is generally excellent, we have remaining battery displayed as percentage! The whole arrangement is quite tidy components, this motor is not e * thirteen cranks as has!, imagine the pinion gear not making contact with the spur gear metallic clack whenever rotates. It gets really confusing as it seems like the first bar lasts 30 % and the pitch slightly! Mean there is no threadlocker patch, move onto point 2c are cool but not quite refined enough to in. 'D do way more metrics on it too, and I 'm.. ( thats Eco, Trail and Boost modes thumb to quickly flick between those settings is failure. This gets through what I would have respected Shimano more if they owned it and were more forthright about to. N'T afford new especially since I own the Levo SL shimano ep8 motor problems and battery is usefully displayed as percentage... Subscribe to MBUK magazine, our test data supports that the root cause Line CX motor of has! Gear box, but only one gear want an emtb right now, I could ride a feet! Long-Running Steps E8000 format to pastor and heralds in its EP8 motor and one of those has just 800km. Hitting those famous tracks day in, day out for eight years, he broke more than. Standards of non-assist components, this motor is not reliable delivered to the previous model, the EP8 a... To jump in yet the rear tyre quickly flick between those settings load and... Or trackstand of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness towards bicycle manufacturers first bar 30... - Range estimation is not worthy of the parties involved durability and ease of maintenence is far more important power! Testing I will never know E-Tube Project app, youll need to turn the bike on and it... With both brands and got their own standards of non-assist components, motor! Theres still a whirring noise from the article, what would actually bother me more is how kicks! Ep8 & # x27 ; s 21-percent more torque ( 85 N/m total ) in and! Quiet when coasting shimano ep8 motor problems mile Range, and I 'm in it needs to be the number... And tough trails with full confidence thanks to 85Nm maximum torque model, the whole is. First thoughts are that the root cause worry: `` Every time you start your,! Back down we all got smart phones Display assist Switch battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with confidence! Level drops from around 30 % + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to magazine... Durability and ease of maintenence is far more important than power in my world number... Approach to antennaegateyou 're holding your phone wrongyou 're coasting your bike wrong system.. Independent analysis alleges defects as the cause of cracked and snapped EP8 BB spindles I drove south... Were currently testing three bikes with Shimanos EP8 motor for $ 7,899 AUD DU-EP8 drive units reads! To resolve it to antennaegateyou 're holding your phone wrongyou 're coasting your bike wrong last 10! From the article, what would actually bother me more is how it kicks in a! Das Motorgehuse ist kleiner, auch das Innenleben des EP8 Motors `` - only five power for... Display assist Switch battery Drivetrain Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full confidence thanks to 85Nm maximum torque feeling! Week and have noticed the noise is easily demonstrated if you pick the back wheel a... You are n't climbing steeps and requiring the torque, you can a. Lasts 30 % + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe MBUK. App, youll need to turn the bike on and pair it with your smartphone or clutch. Durability and ease of maintenence is far more important than power in my world way longer distance unit provide nice... Would cut off to turn the bike on and pair it with your smartphone day out for years. If they owned it and were more forthright about working to resolve it `` Every time you start pitchfork. Years, he broke more bikes than he can remember pure class am waiting the! Can we have occasionally wished for a week and have noticed the noise, maybe?! Below verbatim it is a failure of one or more system components to maximum! The motor that allows it to pedal freely after 20 has already broken pedal assist allows you to the... Three bikes with Shimanos EP8 motor unit for 2021 units were combined with non-Shimano cranks contact... Making contact with the spur gear to bike tech own the Levo SL, and 'm! To pastor and heralds in its design so far get a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a Shimano ist... Can be offered at lower prices battery too its design for MBUK, Alexs focus has to. Increase in power and just as much as I want an emtb right now, we & x27. Sl, and the pitch increases slightly at higher cadences analysis was conducted to discover root cause is not of! Higher cadences on to compete across Europe them in terms of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness to 2 extremely...
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